Comments on: The Prosperity Gospel Veil http://www.reformergent.org/2008/03/04/the-prosperity-gospel-veil/ Version 3.0 Mon, 08 Dec 2008 18:34:46 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9 hourly 1 By: Jim http://www.reformergent.org/2008/03/04/the-prosperity-gospel-veil/comment-page-1/#comment-65 Jim Sun, 30 Mar 2008 14:35:16 +0000 http://www.reformergent.org/2008/03/04/the-prosperity-gospel-veil/#comment-65 For the world to see any formation of Christ…. within the frame work of our society the world has to see Christ through the church For individuals to see Christ … all they need is to see another individual to observe Christ in that person I think the responsibility ..is laid on both peoples shoulders .. I think that more than any time in our world and culture that people need to see how…. we relate …and our response is…. to others in our church and daily lives Jesus said by their fruits ye shall know them..... so we have to be bearers of that kind of fruit as a collective group of people ….That’s how the world sees Christ in us The world is not looking for so much perfection in us … as much as they are looking for answers out of their own imperfections… aren’t you glad the church is full of imperfect people? We are all imperfect.. none of us are of the status where we are perfect or in a group where we would be classified perfect. So we have to look at this and examine… OUR..LIVES through the knowledge and nature of the perfect Christ Jesus Cultures today have seem bent on perfecting a ministry as a profession rather than perfecting the person.. that the minister could be … or the person that the ministers preaches at…. when it is all said and done …..all will pass away but what you have in your heart with Christ will make the difference For the balance of our life we should be interested in how our walk is with god rather than how well we have a ministry or church that’s perfect.. the ministry part will align itself with our walk once we start doing what Christ has commanded believers to do. As we increase in the knowledge of the gospel.. isn’t our goal, whether layman, minister, preacher, priest, or reverend .. to increase kingdom growth? A what… (BMW, house, hunger, poverty, depravity, Money) wont keep you out of heaven A who… or a who… influenced by a what…. may keep a person from the kingdom …… so it’s best to watch who you influence or who influences you. Just a thought Chris… Being from the reformed church … How do you feel about Robert Schuller For the world to see any formation of Christ….

within the frame work of our society the world has to see Christ through the church

For individuals to see Christ …

all they need is to see another individual to observe Christ in that person

I think the responsibility ..is laid on both peoples shoulders ..

I think that more than any time in our world and culture that people need to see how…. we relate …and our response is…. to others in our church and daily lives

Jesus said by their fruits ye shall know them….. so we have to be bearers

of that kind of fruit as a collective group of people ….That’s how the world sees Christ in us

The world is not looking for so much perfection in us …

as much as they are looking for answers out of their own imperfections…

aren’t you glad the church is full of imperfect people?

We are all imperfect.. none of us are of the status where we are perfect or in a group where we would be classified perfect.

So we have to look at this and examine… OUR..LIVES through the knowledge and nature of the

perfect Christ Jesus

Cultures today have seem bent on perfecting a ministry as a profession rather than perfecting the person.. that the minister could be …

or the person that the ministers preaches at….

when it is all said and done …..all will pass away but what you have in your heart with Christ will make the difference

For the balance of our life we should be interested in how our walk is with god rather than how well we have a ministry or church that’s perfect..

the ministry part will align itself with our walk once we start doing what Christ has commanded believers to do.

As we increase in the knowledge of the gospel.. isn’t our goal, whether layman, minister, preacher, priest, or reverend .. to increase kingdom growth?

A what… (BMW, house, hunger, poverty, depravity, Money) wont keep you out of heaven

A who… or a who… influenced by a what…. may keep a person from the kingdom …… so it’s best to watch who you influence or who influences you.

Just a thought Chris…

Being from the reformed church … How do you feel about Robert Schuller

]]> By: Jerrry http://www.reformergent.org/2008/03/04/the-prosperity-gospel-veil/comment-page-1/#comment-55 Jerrry Fri, 28 Mar 2008 12:46:14 +0000 http://www.reformergent.org/2008/03/04/the-prosperity-gospel-veil/#comment-55 Jeremy is 100% correct. If Dollar and Osteen and others who preach a similar message, would allow themselves to be accountable to scrutiny, cease and assist the empty promises theology - twisted scripture and repent, we would then find common ground as broken sinners 100% dependant on the finished work of Christ. Be assured, compassion and forgiveness are available to Dollar and Osteen and others when they will repent and stop making and distributing their cool-aid. We are called to accountability and warned in James 3 that teacheds will be held to higher standards. 1Timothy we are warned about false teachers. We should not be chastized for echoing those warnings in scripture and modeling as well as holding fast to the high standards set by Christ through Peter, Paul and the apostles. Jeremy is 100% correct. If Dollar and Osteen and others who preach a similar message, would allow themselves to be accountable to scrutiny, cease and assist the empty promises theology – twisted scripture and repent, we would then find common ground as broken sinners 100% dependant on the finished work of Christ. Be assured, compassion and forgiveness are available to Dollar and Osteen and others when they will repent and stop making and distributing their cool-aid.
We are called to accountability and warned in James 3 that teacheds will be held to higher standards. 1Timothy we are warned about false teachers. We should not be chastized for echoing those warnings in scripture and modeling as well as holding fast to the high standards set by Christ through Peter, Paul and the apostles.

]]> By: Jeremy http://www.reformergent.org/2008/03/04/the-prosperity-gospel-veil/comment-page-1/#comment-51 Jeremy Thu, 13 Mar 2008 13:02:49 +0000 http://www.reformergent.org/2008/03/04/the-prosperity-gospel-veil/#comment-51 i have always struggled with the prosperity gospel, because it doesn't match up with what i read in the NT. Jesus said we would have trouble in this life, that our families might disown us, that we take up our cross (figuratively and literally in some cases)... none of that seems to gel with the prosperity gospel. to daniel's question above "is he not still a genuine brother?" i am not sure, apostle Paul would say that as long as the gospel is preached, regardless of motive, that is a good thing. where i run into trouble with dollar and osteen, is that i don't hear the gospel being preached... i hear osteen say things like "Jesus wants you to achieve total victory" in finance, health, family, and any other venture that you invest in. i don't hear "die to yourself, go into all the world, pray for those who persecute you, consider others better than yourself." I don't hear "jesus is the way to reconnect with the God that created you" I hear "Jesus is a great way to make your business better." in my opinion, that is not the gospel, it is false teaching, and therefore i would not call him a brother. do i have all the right answers or questions, i don't think so... but Jesus is the answer, and His teachings are what i follow. in doing so i see a life of sacrifice and generosity, not one of wealth and power. i have always struggled with the prosperity gospel, because it doesn’t match up with what i read in the NT. Jesus said we would have trouble in this life, that our families might disown us, that we take up our cross (figuratively and literally in some cases)… none of that seems to gel with the prosperity gospel.

to daniel’s question above “is he not still a genuine brother?” i am not sure, apostle Paul would say that as long as the gospel is preached, regardless of motive, that is a good thing. where i run into trouble with dollar and osteen, is that i don’t hear the gospel being preached… i hear osteen say things like “Jesus wants you to achieve total victory” in finance, health, family, and any other venture that you invest in. i don’t hear “die to yourself, go into all the world, pray for those who persecute you, consider others better than yourself.” I don’t hear “jesus is the way to reconnect with the God that created you” I hear “Jesus is a great way to make your business better.” in my opinion, that is not the gospel, it is false teaching, and therefore i would not call him a brother.

do i have all the right answers or questions, i don’t think so… but Jesus is the answer, and His teachings are what i follow. in doing so i see a life of sacrifice and generosity, not one of wealth and power.

]]> By: Daniel http://www.reformergent.org/2008/03/04/the-prosperity-gospel-veil/comment-page-1/#comment-48 Daniel Thu, 06 Mar 2008 18:05:58 +0000 http://www.reformergent.org/2008/03/04/the-prosperity-gospel-veil/#comment-48 But aren't there <em>some</em> things we can find in common with our lemming family and friends? I think there needs to be. Of course we don't agree with everything Pastor Smiles says, but is he not still a genuine brother? Can't we confront them face-to-face like all the other denominations, trying to explain our beliefs in messy spirituality instead of some perfect and free spirituality? We really don't have all the right answers or the right questions anyways. We can be sincere, but we can also be sincerely wrong. But aren’t there some things we can find in common with our lemming family and friends? I think there needs to be. Of course we don’t agree with everything Pastor Smiles says, but is he not still a genuine brother? Can’t we confront them face-to-face like all the other denominations, trying to explain our beliefs in messy spirituality instead of some perfect and free spirituality? We really don’t have all the right answers or the right questions anyways. We can be sincere, but we can also be sincerely wrong.

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